Public Announcement

[taimatsu]

I would like to announce that all console games, from Donkey Kong to Final Fantasy Three Billion and One, from Sonic the Hedgehog to Phantasy Star Whatever, are an utter waste of time, space and energy. Get outside and do something useful, or at least talk to someone not made of pixels. Thank you.

Comments

[lnr]

Well, they both have their places, but people not made of pixels definitely have a few advantages, and not just the better conversation. Sonic was still fun though.

[zenmeisterin.livejournal.com]

Heh. Well, I totally disagree but then I'm a gamer geek.

[davedevil.livejournal.com]

I have the theme fom why don't you on loop in my head now thanks lucy :)

[j4.livejournal.com]

Or do cross-stitch pictures from the console games (http://www.home.earthlink.net/~grampaslap/graphic/xstitch.html) instead...

[pure-simon.livejournal.com]

A somewhat closeminded view.....after all you could say the same about roleplay, or watching anime, or just about any hobby really (apart from talking to people who aren't pixels, but thats not really a hobby).

It's entertainment the same as watching a movie, it's just different.

To each their own hun, to each their own!

[chrisvenus]

I sense a certain irony hearing this from somebody who spends quite so much time on IRC and the like. From somebdoy who would rather talk to people over IRC/LJ than face to face. From somebody who has an obsession with anime which is at least as much of a waste of time, space and energy as computer games. And I congratulate you on insulting and denigrating the chosen profession of both your housemate and the person I believe you refer to as "SiDaddy".

10/10 on the irony meter. :)

[taimatsu]

IRC and LJ are at least communicating with real people. I watch very little anime these days. despite my ongoing interest. And I do those things in my space, not in shared space. `

Re:

[chrisvenus]

Ah, sorry. So you are annoyed with other people using your shared space?

But isn't playing multiplayer games communicating with real people at the same time? I have played PSO for a grand total of about an hour on my own, the rest has been with MattC and sometimes others. I'd say this isn't particularly anti-social.

I think I'm just extremely annoyed at you being so insulting and denigrating towards one of my (and many other people's) favourite passtimes as well as the way that many people I know make their living. I just think you are being extremely insulting.

[taimatsu]

Well, to be fair, I was in an awful mood when I wrote that. I *do* think computer/console games are a bit silly. I play a few very simple games very occasionally - they tend to be computerised versions of board-type games, or solitaire, which are only coincidentally on the computer (I could just as easily play patience with real cards).

I think that console/computer games, particularly the detailed 'quest/battle' types, are easy to get sucked into and addicted to. I don't think it's healthy to spend hours and hours playing them. This is partly the way I was brought up (my mother refused to buy games consoles for my brothers for years) and partly a genuine dislike. Yes, if you're doing it with other people it can be a social thing - I mean, I've played Bomberman with other people once, and it wasn't bad.

A lot of this whole thing is about space, though. Personal space is a concept which is very important to me, in some hard-wired, not entirely rational ways. I would watch the news, for example, ten times more regularly than I do (about once a fortnight) if MattC were not always using the lounge in the evenings for games. It mildly annoys me that he so often takes it over like that. Of course, he has a right to use it, and I'm bad at negotiating that kind of thing, so I don't bother. It just really got to me when someone who doesn't even live here did the same thing. It felt very intrusive and made me feel uncomfortable. I don't think I should be made to feel like that in my own house.

I didn't mean to insult you. The work that people do creating games is very detailed and skilled, and I can respect that; and I'm sure playing games requires, er, good stuff. Yes. I do find it odd when people want to spend so long interacting, alone, with a game reality.

I just don't really get it, just like you wouldn't want to do Scottish dancing or cross-stitch. I'm sure there are a couple of things I do that you'd find just as silly and pointless as I find console games. I wouldn't usually *say* this, of course - I just got very wound up. ü

[chrisvenus]

OK. That sounds more reasonable. If you don't like games then I can understand that. You're allowed to. My main reason for feeling insulted is that you stated your opinion as fact and that all the time I have spent enjoying games is wasted. Since you now say that is not what you mean then I will stop being insulted. :)

As for the other stuff. Firstly if you want to watch more news without causing issues then the bbc website (and probably others) offer video streams of the news (go to news.bbc.co.uk and there is a link at the top to "watch/listen to BBC news"). They have there the BBC one o'clock news (which it should be noted you could watch since nobody else is around in the day) but I am trying to watch it and it is a bit jerky. I blame piece of shit Real player for that though. :)

On the other point though I can pretty much guarantee that Matt (and anybody else) will be more than happy to stop to let you watch the news. You don't need to feel worried about asking. Computer games are something that can be played any time and the news is only on at set times. This means that you should get some priority on it. Of course if you wanted to watch 8 hours of TV a night then it wouldn't be quite a priority but for one 30 minute news program (sometimes not even that if you see the headlines and don't want to watch any of the rest of it) *nobody* will mind doing this.

To be honest I think you need to make sure you do ask this. Being afraid to ask such a simple question *is* something that sounds to me like it could cause you more serious problems in later life. Being non confrontational and jsut letting things go might be good but if you are getting long term wound up about it then that is a very bad thing, especially given that it is totally unnecessary if you were to just talk to people.

MattN is a slightly different issue, I'll agree. As I said elsewhere I think he has some right to being there. As I said, I consider myself to have some right and I'd have said that Matt has more right than me. This clearly though is a case of fundamentally different opinions on the matter and I think it is clear that krys holds similar opinions to me on the matter. This means that you are not going to get to a satisfactory resolution without talking about it. I would suggest that a satisfactory resolution would be as it is but with clear understanding that you get priority over Matt in things. If you want to watch the television then you say so and you do. However, this goes back to the earlier mentioned point of not liking to ask and that, in my opinion, is your problem and you can't always expect everybody to work around as a result of that. No, I don't think you should be uncomfortable in your own house but yes, I think you could do something about that as well as wanting other people to.

I hope this is useful comments rather than just sounding like I am being rude. *hugs*

Oh, and what client or whatever do you use? Just wondering because there sometimes seem to be random characters appear at the end of your posts and comments. Just wondering if that was to do with client and mac or whatever. See end of post on http://www.livejournal.com/users/taimatsu/102092.html and about half of your comments.

[taimatsu]

If someone else is using $thing_I_want_to_use then they obviously *got there first* and that's a major ingrained 'they get to use it' thing.

I can't get the right plugin to watch the BBC stream from my regular browser.

Why do you have a right to be in someone else's house when you are not a specifically invited guest of someone who is acting as your host at the time? I really don't get it. I mean, if you did what MattN did, I'd be pleased to see you, but I'd still think it was weird and rude of you. If it were Krys's house alone, and no-one else lived here, fine, she can do what she likes about letting people use it whenever. But other people live here, and some of them don't think it's okay.

So, I have to ask. I have to make myself feel uncomfortable in order not to feel uncomfortable. That makes lots of sense. I don't think that your solution works, because I am not going to feel able to *use* that priority. I'm just *not*. I'm not sure what I can do about it. It strikes me that the solution is that random or non-random non-residents don't use shared space when their host is not with them.

The random characters happen when i use the web-client. It's something to do with the browser.

[lanfykins.livejournal.com]

It strikes me that the solution is that random or non-random non-residents don't use shared space when their host is not with them.

Really?

So... if Chris arranged to meet Krys, and she was late, and nobody was using the TV, he wouldn't be allowed to turn it on and watch it, just on the offchance that you might wander down and want to do something else with it but be afraid to ask?

Again, this is asking everyone else to work around your problem, which is not only unreasonable but is going to cause you even more problems later, because you haven't dealt with the root difficulty.

Yes, 'residents' should have priority over 'visitors' when it comes to shared space. And you enforce it by saying, very politely, 'Excuse me - when you've finished that fight/killed that monster/got to a save point I'd like to watch the news.'

And I can almost guarantee you that nobody will look twice at you for it.

Re:

[chrisvenus]

OK. I think I am even more right. With the attitude of they got their first, they get to use it then you are going to be totally screwed in life. The real world doesn't work like that.

I think that I will end up going OTT if I try to expand so I will just leave it at that. I don't think that such an irrational give in logic works.

So anyway, you should be able to watch the BBC stream with Real Player which I thought you had. What browser is it that you use?

And onto the more serious stuff I think you can be invited into a house by somebody who is not there. What about if you were to have a couple of people round and then need to go out to the shops? Would you expect everybody to come out with you or wait outside or would it be reasonable to have them in the house without their host present because they had actually been invited?

And that solution might be a practical one. It would require more clarification on what you mean (since I would assume that using the loo is not banned, and so if they are allowed the bathroom then what else? However, you can't just say that this is the solution you want and expect everybody else to automatically agree with it because it is what you want.

No, you shouldn't feel uncomfortable in your own house but other people shouldn't be uncomfortable either. With this attitude you are quite possibly going to make your other housemates feel uncomfortable about inviting people around if you are going to get stressed with them. What about if I am round and krys offers to let me crash on the couch to save me coming home? Hey, I'm taking up communal space without supervision.

And I think that if you are worried about people being uncomfortable then think about how krys feels having to constantly talk to you about cleaning. I assume the cleaning rota I have seen is accurate and if so krys is doign more cleaning and so on than you are. I have seen the state of the kitchen and krys might be wrong but I hear the stuff lying around is yours.

I totally sound like I am taking sides here I would guess but that isn't my intention. I am trying to just make both of you (since I have been doing the same to krys) try to get a better understanding of where the other person is coming from.

Oh, and if it helps I might be able to solve some of the issues of TV rights by lending you my portable TV. Should be alright for what you are after assuming you get signal in your bedroom.

What are you up to tonight? I'd prefer to continue this conversation in person rather than do it via quite such an impersonal medium.

[taimatsu]

Tonight I am feeling really nauseous and ill. I am also apparently having some kind of 'house meeting' later. Maybe. Who knows?

I'm not sure why i'm having this conversation with you specifically anyway, since this is a house-ground-rules thing and that does seem to limit it to housemates, rather.

I prefer text media to voice media in 95% of situations.

I think in pretty much all the situations you mention, the host should check that the situation is okay with all the other hosuemates who are around or going to be around during the situation to see whether it's okay. Yes, that means if Krys offers to let you crash she should check it's okay with the rest of us first. It's not 'her' space to give you, it's 'our' space.

The kitchen is not actually currently messy. The mess in the dining room is significantly Krys's when it's anyone's. The mess in the lounge is mostly Matt's. I think the house is fairly tidy excewpt for the post, etc. in the dining room and the game-mess in the lounge.

I'm not actually saying 'they got there first' is a sensible or useful viewpoint to take. I'm saying it's an ingrained habit of thought, which I cannot get rid of on five seconds' notice just because someone says I must. Yeah, I'll work on assertiveness, but that is a long-term goal which will still not solve the problem in the short term. Ñ

[taimatsu]

It's a real, genuine problem for me. It's something I find *very hard to do*. I'm not saying it's a sane or useful response to things, but it's going to take me a while to change it, and I don't appreciate being told from all directions that the problem is just mine when I think a number of other people in the situation are also being unreasonable, prescriptive, bossy and generally inconsiderate.

[onyxtears.livejournal.com]

Okay, since you like this forum i'll use it and i'll try and make this as diplomatic as possible.

When you moved in I believe Krystyna spoke with you about me having access to the house when she wasn't there. You were fine with this, or if you weren't you agreed to it anyway.
I then moved in, you were fine with this too.
I moved out and I still had access, again you were fine with this.

Just because Krystyna and I went though a bad patch why does that change anything?

For instance tonight, I am seeing Krystyna after she returns from Karate, she has asked me to come around, Matt C has no problems with me coming around either. It seems stupid me driving all the way to Stokenchurch just to return here again. So i'll stay in Krystyna's room until Matt arrives and maybe use the kitchen for a coffee and the bathroom if I need it.

Prehaps I should also move all of my stuff out of your space, which would include the ironing board the washing up bowl, the draining rack, bowls, cups, glasses, cheese graters, knives, chopping boards, loads of cooking utensils etc the list goes on, all these things you have used and do use from time to time.

Also on another note, about games, as you probably know, Chris and I have not seen eye to eye for quite sometime, due to this game we are now getting on, therefore making Krys happier in the process. I think that's a good thing.

Unfortunately...

[lanfykins.livejournal.com]

...(and as I have had good reason to discover, believe you me) while raising a problem by ranting/muttering/being perfectly reasonable/etc over this medium feels (is?) much easier than doing it face to face, the person who has just seen a problem raised over a (perceived to be) public medium, where they might not even have seen it had they not checked their LJ/email/whatever, tends to get much more annoyed than they would if you had raised it face to face.

I'm not entirely sure why, but then I share your preference for more distancing communication mediums.

It may also simply be the case that things have got to this stage gradually - I don't know. But people do push limits, and unless they're told 'no' they have no reason to realise that they're doing something wrong. So you get from a position of consideration to one that appears to be inconsiderate, without the other person ever thinking they are being so.

And to be honest I don't see what's prescriptive, bossy or unreasonable about playing computer games when nobody objects, but I accept that there may be stuff going on that I have no idea about, so I'll bow out now...

[damerell.livejournal.com]

Except SNES Mario Kart, of course.